Anders Hill Show Notes

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The Game Plan T1D Podcast: Episode 6 - Anders Hill



Sam Benger

Published on Sep 9, 2018



This episode of the Game Plan T1D Podcast features T1D athlete Anders Hill. Anders was diagnosed with T1D during his sophomore year of high school. Unfazed by the news of his diagnosis, Anders went on to play football at Columbia University where he led the Lions at Quarterback. This episode is loaded with practical advice for athletes of all sports. Listen in, learn, and be inspired!



what's going on game plan to indie

community I've got a fantastic episode

for you today I was lucky enough to be

able to sit down with onder's Hill

Hollanders was diagnosed with type 1

diabetes back in his high school days

however the news of his diagnosis didn't

slow him down in the slightest he would

go on to play football at Columbia

University where he was the starting


this episode is chock full with tons of

practical and actionable advice for

athletes of all sports not just football

I really feel like we got into some

really interesting topics so without any

further ado please enjoy my conversation

with onder's hill alright guys so

welcome to the game plan t1d podcast

today on the show we have onder's hill

oddly enough onder's and i met each

other back about was it two weeks ago

now at the Campbell Trophy summit out in

Palo Alto we were at Stanford University

and I saw them doing something

underneath the table and I was like well

okay I think he's I think that might be

an insulin pen and sure enough fellow

diabetics launders welcome to the show

man yeah thanks for having a truth be on

here so

in listening to that other podcast you

were on diabetics doing things and big

shout out to rob how if you haven't

listened to his podcast go check it out

that's diabetics doing things I was

really interested to hear sort of your

diagnosis story and to juxtapose it with

what I went through I was diagnosed when

I was five so I didn't I grew up with

diabetes sort of being my life I didn't

know anything other than that but tell

us about your diagnosis when it happened

what were the circumstances and what was

sort of going through your mind at that

time yeah definitely so like you said I

mean for me it was kind of a different

story so I actually got diagnosed with

type 1 diabetes with I was a sophomore

in high school and I want to say

February so we're just getting John with

the baseball season you know offseason

training hitting the cage and stuff and

I mean before you get diagnosed you

can't really tell

I mean you're kind of constantly drowsy

and I mean I was drinking at least like

three big water ball of the class period

just had Thompson cottonmouth all this

thirst and I mean me being an athlete I

just kind of thought I was dehydrated or

something so just kept trying to drink

water and never really thought much of

it and then my mom kept asking me like

why treat so much water I drink so much

water and I mean getting a high school

you know that you think nothing can ever

really happen to you nothing can go


so I just kind of shrugged her off and

no one in my family had diabetes or

anything but for some reason she knew

that that was kind of a sent them just

kind of wanted to get it checked out

just to make sure course mom feeding

moms well know best so lo and behold

Guild's and my pediatrician and within

five minutes they do ketone tests on my

pee and they basically knew right then

and there that I had diabetes but I'll

go to the Children's Hospital and

luckily they caught it pretty early I

didn't have to be hospitalized for more

than a couple hours or anything like

that I wasn't in ketoacidosis or

anything like that but I mean it was a

shocker that drive I'm from Boulder

Colorado so that drive from Boulder down

to Denver go to the Children's Hospital

I mean they basically just told me I had

diabetes and I had no idea what it was

at the time I mean like you said you

grew up with it so you are always kind

of like I mean when you're five you

don't really know it is but you had a

very clear understanding but for me I

mean I had never even really heard of it

known and my family knew anything about

it or had it so that was a long about

half hour drive down there didn't know

if I was being able to keep playing

sports but figured out that everything

is going to be okay if you just manage

it properly and now ended up playing the

rest of my high school career and end up

having the opportunity to play football

in college it's Lumbee a-- to so ended

up working out really well so yeah

that's how my diagnosis story that drive

over were you just rapidly googling on

your on your phone like just what is

this thing or was it more I'm just going

to wait and hear what the doctors have

to say yeah I mean I I was rapidly

googling and one of the things I think

is honestly kind of most frustrating

about type one

he's about sometimes especially on

google it can get kind of intertwined

and mixed in with type 2 diabetes so I

was half of actually looking at a bunch

of stuff for type 2 diabetes I don't

have no idea what I was actually looking

at I was like well I don't need like

that unhealthy I'm not old I'm not

overweight I thought I had no idea

really what was going on but yeah it was

just a real period of uncertainty for me

but I think that when I got to the

Children's possible they did a great job

to kind of calm me down really laying

out what was going on and how we're

going to tack this and just kind of

developing a game plan absolutely so the

other thing that comes with being

diagnosed at a later age being diagnosed

in high school is that you've had time

over the course of your life or habits

to set in you know be it ways of eating

or sleeping or just different parts of

your life or a little bit more

solidified obviously being an athlete

you're taking better care of yourself

and the average person would but were

there habits in your life in just ways

you went about diet or fitness that

really had to change or that you had to

look at after you're diagnosed yeah I

mean for me personally being from

Boulder Colorado that's a pretty like

health town anyways as it is I think I

already a decently healthy but I mean

the soda thing was a big kind of like

shock to me I mean when you are taking

shots you have to card count and so it

really teaches you to focus on what

you're actually eating and what you're

putting into your body for me I mean

immediately cut out soda and then I

honestly try to just kind of go on a

more low carb diet I think it's much

easier to regulate for me personally

doing kind of a low carb more higher

protein a little bit higher fat with

like nuts and peanut butter and things

like that versus just carbo loading all

the time but I mean sometimes you have

to do it like he does an athlete like

not for the game you need those carbs to

give you a lot of good energy for game

day so yeah I mean I think it's just

overall it honestly made me a lot

healthier person and made me a lot more

aware of my body

obviously I prefer not to have type 1

diabetes but I think looking on the

bright side of things I'm much more

aware of the things that I'm eating and

the things

putting into my body than the average

person which I think has actually made

me healthier in the long run I

absolutely think that's one of the

biggest and best takeaways from kind of

reflecting on life as a diabetic and I

think that's one of the best frame of

minds to look at your diagnosis with is

that it really is a blessing in disguise

because we live in an age now where we

have such processed foods around us and

stuff like that that you really need to

know and be aware and be accountable for

what you're putting in your body so as

I'm sure you know and growing up with

IBS we are very familiar with

nutritional labels and how many carbs

yeah food is it high in fat which will

like you know a piece of pizza will

impact your blood sugar differently then

a can of soda even though they may have

you know a similar amount of

carbohydrates so you want to get your

take on what was sort of the mindset

that you adopted at the start right at

your diagnosis and how that kind of

changed over time yeah I think for me

one of the biggest things was just

understanding what it was at first and

once I have that and once I worked with

my doctors and worked with my family to

kind of establish a game plan of how we

were going to best manage this I think

it was just go attack it you know I

think that it was something that I

realized if I took care of and managed

and wouldn't change my quality of life

or anything like that it wouldn't stop

me from doing any of the things but I

know I could do and know that I wanted

to do so I always went into with the

mindset of I'm going to try and be the

best dog that I can be with my a one C

with just managing my blood sugar things

like that so I'm not affected or in any

negative way especially in terms of

sports that was always one of my biggest

motivations I never wanted to have a

super bad low blood sugar high blood

sugar and feel drowsy in the middle of a

game or something like that because I

didn't want it to affect my level of

play so I think for me it was always

just kind of a challenge and I just kind

of looked at it in a way where it's like

hey if anyone's going to get diagnosed

with it the good thing it's me because I

think I'll be able to best manage it so

yeah I mean it was really just once you

realized that it's kind of up to you you

know there's a lot of personal

responsibility that you can take and you

kind of make it what it is you know like

you can not take good care of your body

or you can't take care of your good body

and that kind of goes for whether you

have diabetes or not so I just looked at

it like might as well do the best that I

can you know mm-hmm it really forces you

to aspire to a higher level of health

because it's that much more high stakes

being insulin dependent but I wanted to

talk about your time at Columbia what

were some of the the challenges you

faced and how were you able to overcome

those yeah I think for me

one of the biggest things is just always

making sure at a snack there's something

like a Gatorade or

like a little glucose pack with me

wherever I went because I think before

arm I was kind of a lot on like my

parents or just any like you you kind of

take it for granted when you're at home

and your house is always stocked to the

brim with food in the fridge or

something like that but I mean when

you're in a dorm room I mean college

freshmen two guys on the football team

you know lured up exactly living large

like that though always just making sure

that you have snacks just being very

self aware of how you feel you know

they're just not as not nearly as much

as a safety blanket when you're living

on your own and you're away from home

especially with the low blood sugar

thing I think you have to be much more

cognizant and aware of that because see

your roommates out of the room or

something you're taking out and you get

a super bad low blood sugar I mean

before it's like girls you have your

parents around to help you out or

something like that but when you're on

your own

and there's known around to help you

need to be really self aware so I think

I found myself testing a lot more when I

went away to college just trying to

really get a better baseline see how I

was feeling and things like that and

also too with the prescriptions I mean

in high school my mom always kind of got

everything for me from the pharmacy so

just learning how to manage that always

make sure I was always stocked up with

everything was really important but

again I mean it's just a little bit of a

learning curve that you have to deal

with sometimes just like we need to get

diagnosed but once you start doing the

right thing they kind of settle into

rhythm it just becomes second nature so

again nothing that's too challenging

that can't be done yeah I think always

as a diabetic erring on the side of

caution and really for any chronic

illness is the the right way to get when

you discussed two different coping

mechanisms you had one and and it's a

good idea always carrying fast-acting

glucose on you no matter where you go

the other ones checking more often some

people have si GM's now constant glucose

monitors other people don't it's an

awesome idea even with a CGM to be

calibrating and making sure you have an

idea of where you're at and contains on

yourself but I want to talk about game

days this is something that I had a

particularly tough time with because I

am super I don't know anxious I guess

you could say but I had such adrenaline

on Saturday mornings and that would just

destroy any stability that I had my

blood sugar and I'd be you know all of

Friday making sure I ate properly in

Saturday morning I need a really clean

low carb breakfast and then it was just

like an hour away from game time ninety

minutes out it would all just go to hell

and blood Sugar's would be going up and

down oh I wanted to get your take on if

you kind of had a similar experience and

how you tried to handle that challenge

yeah I think for me just as a

quarterback I would never get as jacked

up as other people you know I was trying

to stay a little bit more like Tom but

yeah exactly the same thing where it's

just that adrenalin you know and I mean

especially carries through even for

hours after the game as well find myself

running high for hours after game too

but I think anytime that adrenaline

comes into play one of the most

important things at least I've found for

myself is that never to overcorrect

because then you're just going to crash

an hour later you know so for me even if

I was running high before a game I would

always Drive I always kind of looked at

it as a false high so I knew that I was

jacked up I knew that I had adrenaline

going through me so if I was like 170 or

something I wouldn't take any insolence

try and get back down to like a hundred

level you know I was always okay with

running a little bit hot because

personally I found that I didn't feel

like I had high blood sugar because like

I said I thought it was a false high

from the adrenaline and I would always

rather be a little bit on the higher end

especially when I'm really exerting

myself versus kind of teetering on the

brink of like a crash and then having to

deal with that in the middle of the game

which was very

restful yeah again I think airing on

that that high side is the way to go did

you're trained in your training staff

and you have kind of some hard and fast

numbers that they were like all right we

want you to be at least 80 or above to

be in the game was there any sort of

system in place like that that you

needed to hit certain marks um no not

really I mean with my trainers they

always kind of defer to my judgment

because I was the one that had diabetes

for four or five years running outside

so I think they trusted me and trusted

how I was feeling so I would test during

the game probably once a quarter and I

always found myself to be pretty level

and stable I never really had a problem

with it I honestly never had the really

like take insulin or I'd always like sip

on a Gatorade now and then during the

game just to make sure I was running a

little bit on that higher and like we

talked about but with the training staff

way obviously they're very aware so I

had diabetes and they'd always have

glucose packs with them and an extra

meter with them and I mean sometimes you

kind of lose track top of the game so

they check up on me ask buy tested help

me out with that but now there was never

really like a mark I would have to hit

to like be able to go back in the game

or anything like that so for me I think

I had a great training stuff like that

and I think it was good of them just

kind of preferred my judgment and I

think I was pretty self-aware with how I

was feeling

so yeah I think and I wanted to continue

talking about your reliance on the

training staff because I think for me it

took some time for me to fully open up

to the training staff and I mean I think

I was overly independent with my

diabetes care like you guys aren't going

to understand you know I'm the one who's

been living with it for 15 years and

you're not going to be able to add value

to this situation but I really think

that's that strategy totally backfired

because keeping them in the dark is just

the wrong idea whether it's they're not

going to have glucose tabs on them out

on the field or they're just not going

to know where I'm at during a game or

during a practice so what was it like

for you starting to rely on that

training staff yeah I think when you're

in high school when you're at home I

mean everyone's kind of aware of your

situation idea

Cooper friendship family like you grew

up with it like you said you got it for

15 years everyone knows so going into a

new situation where you don't know

anyone you don't know the training stuff

you don't know your teammates around you

you're kind of feeling out getting to

know people I mean it can be hard to

kind of bring up what you might think be

the right time say hey I'm the type 1

diabetic you know I mean for me I talked

to my roommate about it right away

because I had needles all over the place

so I tell him but it kind of came in

waves I guess I think for me like I do

with a group of friends and they DVD

something I'd open up some of them about

and tell them but I definitely agree

that with the training staff at least it

took me at least a year to tell them

just especially because I think when

you're getting recruited - you don't

really want to tell the coaches that are

treating you that you are a type 1

diabetics be honest you don't want it to

not that it should or would in any way

but it's just something that you don't

the recruiting process was already

pretty crazy I didn't want to affect

that in any way so then once I got on

campus all I was a little worried about

how do I bring this up what do I do here

and then it was actually in flake I

think because we had to be there for the

whole summer so when it was probably in

like week three or something in my

freshman season I had a low blood sugar

during practice one day I was like hey

like I need you where'd the Gatorade

where's the Gator they pointed me in the

right direction on there like what was

that and I ended up opening up about

them and they were like like why didn't

you tell us this you know like um so I

think for me if looking back on it like

you said I should have been way more

open up front but I mean as an 18 year

old kid coming into new situations

something that not to be embarrassed

about it but just something that is kind

of like closed but hits close to home

and you can be protective of sometimes

just like you said so my advice to

anyone would just be don't be afraid to

open up to people about it especially

those that can really make an impact on

you with it like a training staff if

you're an athlete yeah I think

especially in football too you have this

like macho culture and it's like mad

there's nothing that's going to hold me

back from going out and just you know

whether it's two-a-days during Korean

camp or during

nothing's going to hold me back and

actually being vulnerable is way more

advantageous in the long run to having a

successful career than you know just

trying to carry dick back but it's only

on your own back but you brought it an

interesting and everyone is there to

help you to everyone here to help you so

it's not like you know like that's their

job so even though sometimes you can

seem like you might be burdening them or

something like that they want to help

and they're there to help yeah it sounds

like that was the reaction they had and

he told them it was like why why did you

wait all this time because like you said

that's their sole purpose yeah yeah you

brought up an interesting topic and it's

something that I've discussed a lot on

this podcast with our guests and it's

the fact that type 1 diabetes largely

especially with the technology that's

out there right now with see GM's that

run to your phone through bluetooth and

insulin palms that are wireless and that

run to a PDM that kind of looks like a

cell phone this chronic illness diabetes

is and can be invisible to the to the

outside people and the people that don't

really know us closely I remember our

first game we were on the road and I did

a shot in the locker room and I was back

on pens at this point and everyone's

looking at me all wide-eyed and you know

sure like my roommate and a few of the

guys I was I was close with back then

knew that it was insulin but everyone

else is like yeah I was this kid

shooting up with like his steroids in

the locker room like this man like

what's the deal but I wanted to ask you

do you feel like there's an obligation

as a diabetic as a diabetic athlete even

more so to be sort of vocal and sort of

self advocating about your own diabetes

to try to be an inspiration other people

and to try to just let them know that

they're sort of not alone in their

diabetes what's your take on being

demonstrative with your treatment yeah I

think as I've gotten to learn more and

more about it and as I've got more

comfortable with my situation with it I

think that's definitely true I found

myself to be more demonstrative about I

mean even starting work now within the

first couple days like I wasn't trying

to hide it you know usually what will

happen now is I don't really go out of

my way

and bringing up out of the blue to tell

someone but I won't hide it so like I'll

take a shot at my - kind of just out in

the open and do whatever and then some

be like hey what's that else take 5-10

minutes to explain it to them I was like

okay great like if there's anything I

can do to help let me know

and that happened with my boss the other

day our head of corporate strategy his

daughter actually has type 1 diabetes -

and I had no idea so I think when you

are more open and demonstrative about it

- you kind of like grow that Network and

you actually find out that a lot more a

lot more people than you think know

about type 1 diabetes they know someone

who has it they know someone is affected

by it or they themselves might have it

like you and I found at the conference

this weekend so I think that being the

monster is about it speaking up about it

setting a good example for maybe younger

people who are just learning about it

and who do how that I think can be a

really powerful thing and I mean I could

be honest with you I bonded with my new

boss over that and we're going to do a

JDRF walk here in the fall so I mean

it's great you know I think the more you

can kind of grow that community and

educate more people about it the better

yeah I have in for the audience I cannot

agree with that more the amount of times

you you bring up the fact that you're a

diabetic or that I bring up this podcast

and that this is a project I'm working

on the amount of times people either

know someone in their family or a close

friend who has diabetes or they know

someone who works in sort of the

endocrinology space the diabetes space

it seems like nine times out of ten

there's some degree of connection there

so it's yeah and those opportunities

usually like just with your boss lead to

really cool opportunities for bonding

and for networking and stuff like that

and again and I think - also for the

people that don't know about as well

it's just an education experience is

like I said sometimes it can be kind of

frustrating when someone doesn't know

the difference between type 1 diabetes

or type 2 diabetes or what it actually

is because they think you're just kind

of like is unhealthy person when in

reality that's not really the case so

for me I think

actually really enjoy talking to someone

about it to who had no idea about type 1

diabetes going into it because then I

educate them on it better and then they

now have a better idea about diabetes

going forward and just kind of like

raises awareness for the whole situation

and for the disease as a whole you know

absolutely so if someone ever told you

you look too healthy to have diabetes

yeah yeah yeah that's happening many

times there's actually one time in Maya

is in one like business class I was

taking school but it was for like this

diabetes it was this case study on some

diabetes man I can't remember exactly

who it was but they kept it was a type-2

diabetes drug that they were referring

to but they never in the case that he

distinguished between type 1 and type 2

and the whole time I was like this is

ridiculous like they're it's just they

have no clue what they're actually

talking about with it so it can be

frustrating sometimes but I think like

you said just having a dialogue with

there's nothing to like be mad about

with it you know it's like I don't blame

someone for not knowing about it I

didn't know anything about it before I

got diagnosed but I think that the more

you can have open dialogues with people

about it the more you just raise

awareness for the cause and the better

you know yeah I don't think you should

ever like you said be looked on is like

how do you not know this it's like of

course exact what we know about it and

we're diagnosed with it we live with it

every day but you don't expect anyone

else to yeah yeah absolutely it's it's a

great like you said opportunity to look

at it as a chance to educate someone but

I want to go back here your Columbia

days and you're talking about some

different support networks with the

training staff there but you also were

in sort of a unique situation where one

of your teammates

Kyle Kastner was also a type 1 diabetic

talk about how you guys sort of a

figured out that you were both juvenile

diabetics but also what was that

relationship like and being able to kind

of lean on him and have an

lean on you during certain times yeah so

I actually I knew that we had a kiss

using the grade below me so I knew that

we had to create another diabetic Claire

because I talked to him when he was on

his recruiting visit when I was a

freshman his senior high school and so

there was just like this ongoing running

joke amongst all my friends on the team

like what are we just like recruiting

all diabetes players knowledge that's

going on hair like um but no I it was a

great experience for me like you said

because I personally had never really

known anyone else my age you had type 1

diabetes like obviously I had met people

at Barbara Davis telling the Children's

Hospital something like that but no one

I had a real close relationship to that

I can kind of have a dialogue with and

be like oh when you're running high

hearing a game what do you do or go back

and forth and kind of just hear their

thoughts and hear their best practices

and what works for them in different

situations so it was actually great

having him come on the team and I mean

you doubt it again it kind of adds not

that it's something to rely on you

should always kind of have your own

stuff and be prepared but having another

little layer of a safety blanket with

him on the team I mean sometimes oh I

have a butcher forgot something to eat

cause you have a Gatorade in your locker

do you have glucose near Locker oh yeah

go ahead take this though I'm just

having another person kind of really

really understood what I was going

through um was great to have and just

like you said having dialogue back and

forth having open conversations it was

great I think kwame's football team

might be one of the most enlightened

about diabetes in the antia black so

that's awesome so now we were talking

before we started recording here about

how we're both washed-up now I use that

term affectionately but so what

what is the game plan going forward now

that now we're both done playing

football how are you planning to stay

active and obviously fitness and

exercise or such crucial parts of

maintaining stable levels of blood sugar

what's your strategy going forward and

you know with a very demanding job how

are you going to try to balance all that

and what

here your strategy for exercise and

staying fit going forward I feel lucky

just because I love exercise it doesn't

seem like a burden to me or something I

was like I have to go work out after

work you know I gotta look forward to

getting off work and then go to the gym

working out getting a good sweat on so I

try and at least do something active

every day I usually a lift and like do

cardio at least like five or six times a

week and I will play like basketball or

something too but I think that it is so

important to at least every not you

don't have to do it every day but at

least a majority of the week get out

there get a good sweat on get your heart

rate up and be active because for me

when I'm on vacation and I don't work

out for a week or something it's just my

blood sugar just goes crazy you know

like especially when you're used to that

you have a routine I think that's so

important to do when you do develop a

very kind of regimented routine it just

makes it easier to maintain good blood

sugar levels because it becomes

regimented it becomes kind of like your

body gets into a rhythm and gets into a

sink of alright this is how much I'm

going to be exerting myself so when you

end up taking the same amounts of

insulin every day it's just I think it's

just good practice for regulating blood

sugar so for me I really prioritize I

think it's one of the most important

things for regulating my diabetes and

also just kind of like keeping me sane

when you know you're sittin at a desk

for 1213 hours a day I give you credit

that's tough but on that sort of message

of advice we like to ask this question

all of our guests if you could send a

message to the diabetic community

perhaps as someone who is just diagnosed

or someone that's having a particularly

tough time managing their diabetes right

now what would your message be to that

community and why I think for me oh just

be reach out to as many different

diabetics as you can and hear their

stories I mean this is I listen to a

couple year of podcasts before this and

like you said did the diabetics peirong

things one but I mean it's easy to kind

of live in a shell live in this bubble

with diabetes but I think that if you do

as much as you can to reach out to

people hear their stories and learn as

much as you can about

type one diabetes it just really broad

your horizon you realize more and more

that it can be kind of a blessing in

disguise with being more aware of your

health and eating better and exercising

more and it won't hold you back at all I

mean look at you you played college

football night here in this great

podcast so I think you're a prime

example of looking at it in a very

positive way and doing the most with it

so I think anyone who's struggling with

it or just got diagnosed I think it's

very easy to get down yourself and be

like why me

come on like this is just such a

hospital this is such a burden but when

you have dialogues with people you reach

out you can understand better and better

each day and learn more that you know

this is something I really can manage

and it doesn't have to slow me down at

all just look at all these other things

people are doing and also hearing that

others have gone through the same kind

of struggles and questioning that you

have it makes you feel a lot better you

know that sometimes it's like well I can

buy the only one dealing with this know

there's a whole community of people out

there that have been through what you've

been through and are here to help I love

it that's awesome man and yeah I think

it's like you know we talked about how

diabetes can be advantageous from just

your own making sure your health is so

dialed in and being accountable for what

you're fueling your body with from a

food standpoint but it's also like just

from a community standpoint it's really

it's really nice to be part of this

diabetic community and this sort of

diabetic athlete community because there

are some really cool people in it and I

would I would definitely endorse your

message like go out there go online

search diabetic athlete and there are so

many just inspirational stories out

there and there's no need to feel alone

in the process we all go through

different challenges and tough times but

the amount of success that people are

having out there with type 1 diabetes is

just astounding and it's awesome and

it's uplifting and just seek out these

doors and be inspired so my last

question I got to ask you set on the

diabetics doing things podcast at your

Jay Cutler fan I'm going to give you 36

I mean he's diabetic for one type one

value so had to be a jade color fair of

course but uh no I just think it's I

don't know it's just cool to see someone

who's playing the highest level with

diabetes I think he even though he can

come off as kind of a grasp on times on

Sunday Night Football or something like

that I think that the more I've

researched him he's actually done a lot

of great things through type one

diabetes so I love to get Jay Keller

prop crops and refer him whenever he's

plan yeah I actually I think he has a

scholarship program that I applied for

back in the day so yeah Whittle actually

love to have Jay Cutler on the program

no hard feelings Raja at all just giving

them up that's awesome man so onder's

thank you so much for coming on the show

man it was a pleasure meeting you out of

Stanford and a pleasure talking to you

tonight thanks so much for coming on the

podcast I appreciate it

no problems down glad to be on here I am

on durcell I have type 1 diabetes and I

have a game plan we hope you enjoyed

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